Godwin's Law of Nazi Analogies is proved correct once again! As with all of the refutations posted on St. Justin Martyr's Blog, I encourage you to view the item linked below first and then precede with reading the refutation.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LkHTyaARG4M&feature=channel_video_title
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Another common flawed argument was used against the Christian God by an anti-Christian polemicist on Youtube. The approach employed by the poster was to speak of some god who is a general amalgamation of Protestant ideas about God. Speaking generally about Christianity, he claimed that "the threat of punishment" was evidence against the veracity of Christianity.
The first image in the video was an image of the WBC. No surprise, given that this video is of extremely low intellectual quality. It is not surprising that an image of this false denomination, which follows heretical (Calvinistic), hateful teachings is propped up as "part of Christianity" as is implied by the argument. The inherent falsity of WBC doctrines is used here by the polemicist as ammunition to attack "Christianity."
The polemicist claims that because "Christianity entails threats if you don't believe in it," it must be false. He argues that arguments which imply punishment are false since they do not stand on their own. So what is punishment? Is punishment a material thing? Punishment only serves to deter people from committing bad deeds. The execution of a murder does not bring their victims back to life. The caning of a thief does not in and of itself return lost goods that were fenced immediately following a robbery.
So does Christianity entail threats of punishment? If one examines the Orthodox understanding of Hell and of any sort of Divine punishment, one shall conclude that the punishments issued by God are always of a corrective nature. Hell is not a tool of manipulation, it is rather the state of broken communion with God. Hell is the direct result of one's actions, not a legalistic prison-status with literal earthly fire as it has been categorized in Western Christendom. It has been said before that Hell is "God's last mercy," in that He will not force someone to spend eternity with Him if they do not want to. Christ said of our Father in Heaven: "...He makes His sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust" (Matt 5:45). God bestows mercy to all people, regardless of their deeds. This is in His nature. However, as a parent chastises a child for being mischievous, so too does our God guide us toward truth. Again, the only real accomplishment from punishment is deterrence. The reason a parent may spank a child, thus causing momentary discomfort, is to get them out of the habit of doing bad things. At a later time, as the child gains intelligence, they will gain the ability to recognize that which is bad and that which is good. The punishment in and of itself does not restore that which was lost through evil deeds.
The punishments issued by God in the Old Testament, the type that Atheist apologists jump at so frequently, were all aimed at correcting humanity's iniquities, as well as preserving and enriching the nation of Israel. Now, what Protestant groups may say about the "anger" or "vengeance" of God, do not agree with the ancient teachings of the Orthodox Church, nor is it consistent with Divine mercy. A straw-christ is being attacked, as usual.
The polemicist claims that there is a threat in the Christian faith, intentionally placed in order to coerce people into belief. In fact, the situation is quite different. The message about the dangers on non-conformance is this: that Christ is the way to salvation, and that there is no other way other than through Him. This is a warning concerning reality. The polemicist in the video would have his viewers believe that Christian doctrine is like a mother telling her child, "...don't make faces: your face is going to stick that way!" This statement is of course a lie. But Christian doctrine tells us something quite different, it reveals truth much like a mother telling her child, "...don't bash your head against the floor: you'll get brain damage!" Unlike many Protestant churches, and the Medieval Roman Catholic Church, the Orthodox Church does not claim that all non-adherents are categorically damned. We simply do not believe this. However, the harsh warnings given in the New Testament and in the patristic writings concerning those outside of the Church still stand. Those who know of the truth of Christ, and subsequently of His Church, yet refrain from participation, damn themselves. Those who sin in ignorance are in a different situation. In any case, it was Christ that created salvation, and all who will be saved, irrespective of their background, will be saved through Christ, and Christ alone.
Concerning the matters discussed in the last paragraph, a response from St. Theophan the Recluse to an inquirer explains the Orthodox position on the un-Churched. Theophan said the Lord would take care of those outside of The Church, and that they had a savior who became incarnate and died for them just as those in The Church do. But the Orthodox Church teaches that those who are not united to the Church are in spiritual danger. It is best for all people to embrace Christ and to be incorporated into the Orthodox Church: the body of which Christ is the head.
The polemicist says that Christians "don't have logical or objective evidence on their side," and therefore resort to coercion. This brings us to another subject, one that hopefully the author can elaborate on in a future article. The "objective evidence" on the side of the Christian faith is in the writings about Jesus Christ, both inside and outside of the New Testament. He was indeed a real historical figure. Both Christians and non-Christians wrote about him. And if one is so bold as to declare Jesus of Nazareth never existed, they can just as easily claim that Julius Cesar never existed. We Christians believe in Christ, and the Orthodox Church, as an institution, preserves the method of being Christian, and the ontological truths concerning God and man.
The argument presented in the above linked video simply falls apart when confronting the doctrines of the Orthodox Church. The message of the Orthodox Church is that we should love Christ, in whom we find ultimate fulfillment as human beings, not that we should simply fear being cast into literal, earthly fire.
================================================================
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LkHTyaARG4M&feature=channel_video_title
================================================================
Another common flawed argument was used against the Christian God by an anti-Christian polemicist on Youtube. The approach employed by the poster was to speak of some god who is a general amalgamation of Protestant ideas about God. Speaking generally about Christianity, he claimed that "the threat of punishment" was evidence against the veracity of Christianity.
The first image in the video was an image of the WBC. No surprise, given that this video is of extremely low intellectual quality. It is not surprising that an image of this false denomination, which follows heretical (Calvinistic), hateful teachings is propped up as "part of Christianity" as is implied by the argument. The inherent falsity of WBC doctrines is used here by the polemicist as ammunition to attack "Christianity."
The polemicist claims that because "Christianity entails threats if you don't believe in it," it must be false. He argues that arguments which imply punishment are false since they do not stand on their own. So what is punishment? Is punishment a material thing? Punishment only serves to deter people from committing bad deeds. The execution of a murder does not bring their victims back to life. The caning of a thief does not in and of itself return lost goods that were fenced immediately following a robbery.
So does Christianity entail threats of punishment? If one examines the Orthodox understanding of Hell and of any sort of Divine punishment, one shall conclude that the punishments issued by God are always of a corrective nature. Hell is not a tool of manipulation, it is rather the state of broken communion with God. Hell is the direct result of one's actions, not a legalistic prison-status with literal earthly fire as it has been categorized in Western Christendom. It has been said before that Hell is "God's last mercy," in that He will not force someone to spend eternity with Him if they do not want to. Christ said of our Father in Heaven: "...He makes His sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust" (Matt 5:45). God bestows mercy to all people, regardless of their deeds. This is in His nature. However, as a parent chastises a child for being mischievous, so too does our God guide us toward truth. Again, the only real accomplishment from punishment is deterrence. The reason a parent may spank a child, thus causing momentary discomfort, is to get them out of the habit of doing bad things. At a later time, as the child gains intelligence, they will gain the ability to recognize that which is bad and that which is good. The punishment in and of itself does not restore that which was lost through evil deeds.
The punishments issued by God in the Old Testament, the type that Atheist apologists jump at so frequently, were all aimed at correcting humanity's iniquities, as well as preserving and enriching the nation of Israel. Now, what Protestant groups may say about the "anger" or "vengeance" of God, do not agree with the ancient teachings of the Orthodox Church, nor is it consistent with Divine mercy. A straw-christ is being attacked, as usual.
The polemicist claims that there is a threat in the Christian faith, intentionally placed in order to coerce people into belief. In fact, the situation is quite different. The message about the dangers on non-conformance is this: that Christ is the way to salvation, and that there is no other way other than through Him. This is a warning concerning reality. The polemicist in the video would have his viewers believe that Christian doctrine is like a mother telling her child, "...don't make faces: your face is going to stick that way!" This statement is of course a lie. But Christian doctrine tells us something quite different, it reveals truth much like a mother telling her child, "...don't bash your head against the floor: you'll get brain damage!" Unlike many Protestant churches, and the Medieval Roman Catholic Church, the Orthodox Church does not claim that all non-adherents are categorically damned. We simply do not believe this. However, the harsh warnings given in the New Testament and in the patristic writings concerning those outside of the Church still stand. Those who know of the truth of Christ, and subsequently of His Church, yet refrain from participation, damn themselves. Those who sin in ignorance are in a different situation. In any case, it was Christ that created salvation, and all who will be saved, irrespective of their background, will be saved through Christ, and Christ alone.
Concerning the matters discussed in the last paragraph, a response from St. Theophan the Recluse to an inquirer explains the Orthodox position on the un-Churched. Theophan said the Lord would take care of those outside of The Church, and that they had a savior who became incarnate and died for them just as those in The Church do. But the Orthodox Church teaches that those who are not united to the Church are in spiritual danger. It is best for all people to embrace Christ and to be incorporated into the Orthodox Church: the body of which Christ is the head.
The polemicist says that Christians "don't have logical or objective evidence on their side," and therefore resort to coercion. This brings us to another subject, one that hopefully the author can elaborate on in a future article. The "objective evidence" on the side of the Christian faith is in the writings about Jesus Christ, both inside and outside of the New Testament. He was indeed a real historical figure. Both Christians and non-Christians wrote about him. And if one is so bold as to declare Jesus of Nazareth never existed, they can just as easily claim that Julius Cesar never existed. We Christians believe in Christ, and the Orthodox Church, as an institution, preserves the method of being Christian, and the ontological truths concerning God and man.
The argument presented in the above linked video simply falls apart when confronting the doctrines of the Orthodox Church. The message of the Orthodox Church is that we should love Christ, in whom we find ultimate fulfillment as human beings, not that we should simply fear being cast into literal, earthly fire.
